Custom Baits - Forum
Jigs, Spinnerbaits and Sinkers => Painting and Finishing Lures => Topic started by: ctom on 09/04/13 20:15 UTC
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I have a higher end Paasche air brush that has been used mainly with india inks and some alcohol based paint/inks. About a year ago it developed an attitude which, upon sending it to a specialist, it was determined that a slug of product got sucked into one of the tiny passages. Its been cleaned and put back in operating status. My question surrounds the water-based paints designed for air brushing and whether the paints can be used straight from the factory bottle....do they require thinning? I have the Do-It paint set, 12 starter colors. If these need thinning, what consistency am I looking for? Any help will be appreciated and I'll offer thanks in advance.
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from what I recall - you want the consistency of "milk" - most water based paints should not need any additional thinning - I used to use an airbrush quite a bit when I was building scale models, and the paints that were 'made for airbrushing' never required any additional thinning.
The biggest thing you want to watch for, of course, is if the paint is not mixed well, or if you don't quite get it cleaned and a bit dries in it and gets knocked off later.
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Those paints, like all of Do-It Paints, are made by Component Systems/CS Coatings. That water based product they claim is airbrush ready strait from the bottle. I would certainly be sure that it is mixed well first, but as it is a water based product if it would need any thinning a small amount of water should suffice. The "milk" consistancy seems to be spot on but I would not hesitate to contact CS Coatings with any further technical quesitons concerning any of their products. (877) 845-3009, www.csipaint.com
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While these are all good answers and in my opinion is a great starting point the only thing variable is your air brush. The tip you have in it will tell you if further reduction is necessary. Small tip thinner material. Big tip thicker material. Not sure if your brand of airbrush use a small medium large way of telling how big it is. Most import air brushes have an actual number like .3,.5. This is in millimeters and does make things bait easier to say it is a .5 tip and not a medium tip because from passche and badger might not be the same. I have a tendency to get the biggest tip I can and turn down the needle to get what I want and for the most part don't get clogs. If I do I just open up the volume and flush it out and go back to what I was doing. Cleaning them and knowing where most problems lie is something to try and teach your self this way it never has to be sent out.
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You will need to keep the tip clean. The water base paints that I use seem to dry at the tip quite often. I have been spraying with createx.
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Thanks guys. I'll check out the tips, there are three or four with the gun, and swap out for a larger one since I am wanting to do larger areas. Alcohol and inks really are super thin and will create a cloud in a larger tip in this gun even when used with very moderate air pressure. I am using a compressor with the gun that is designed for air brushes. I never used the gun with the water-based paints before and after having this gun plug I guess I am a little gun shy. Gotta get some lake trout/salmon blades finished for later this month.
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I've tried several (brush ready) paints and none were consistent, what I mean is some shot right out of the bottle and some didn't within the same brand. Paint pigments can be natural or synthetic and are milled to different sizes and volumes to achieve the desired color, I did a little test just the other day with brand new unopened bottles of the same brand paint and was surprised with the results: I weighed a bottle of white and it came in at 92 grams so I weighed the second bottle of white and it was 91 grams but as I weighed the other colors they were all over the place all the way down to 64 grams this was clearly due to pigment load.
Frank is spot on with the tip size, here's an example I can shoot craft paint after thinning down with my .66 tip but would never be able to get consistency with my .25 tip, what's the difference well my .66 tip is comparable to a rattle can and my .25 is like a pencil. The tip size dictates how thin the paint you're using needs to be. I have found that Spectra-tex did the best so far out of the bottle with little reducing and can tell you that Createx standard paint needs to be reduced.
Also your air pressure comes into play depending on what type of brush you're using i.e. a gravity fed will require less air pressure than a siphon fed for the simple fact that more pressure is required to pull the paint through the bottle and up the tube to the tip, what does this mean well in my limited experience the lower the pressure you can get away with it seems to be I have more control over the application of paint. The bottom line is embrace the fact of reducing paint, learn it and you will have eliminated one piece in the puzzle.
And as stated the general rule here for reducing paint is the consistency of "skim milk" how in the world anyone can tell between skim milk and 2% milk is beyond me but a good rule of thumb is 1:1 ratio of reducer to paint. I know there are homebrew reducers that work great and are a hell of allot cheaper than brand specific reducers but I encourage you to start with a bottle of brand specific reducer until your confident with using your brush with the brand Paint of your choosing and go from there.
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That's really helpful stuff, G2L. Thank You.
I could always go back to spray cans and stencils for the stuff I do on the salmon/trout blades but I like the control and pin point control the air brushes provide. I'll put all this together tomorrow and see what the world says when all is done.
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Just gotta ask. Gone2lonng where did you get those numbers? Are you using an air brush made in the US and got those sizes from the manufacturer? The .66 has got me just seems like the largest one from say badger. Never knew the metric size of a US air brush. But if it is, it is good to know. My favorite gun(I say this because it is an air brush with a trigger) has a .8 tip. I had to build it with that tip because they did not offer it that way. Great for one shot painting but no room for error.
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Hey Frank I bought an Iwata neo with a .35 while I was waiting for delivery of the Paasche Talon TG3 it's the set with three different needle/tip sizes:
Includes:
-6ft braided hose,
-wrench,
-nozzle wrench,
-hanger,
-Needles, Tips, and Head Caps in all three sizes! (.25mm, .38mm and .66mm)
-Plus! The new Fan Aircap (TAF-3.)
Not sure what to make of the fan cap, I put it on the .66 setup and it seemed very uneven with the 1 test I did so the jury is still out on that one but I can tell ya that the .66 will suck the paint out of the cup in the blink of an eye! And I would highly recommend to anyone just getting started to look at the neo, it's not made by but for Iwata and for the money $55) it's a great little brush, the Talon is one honking piece of metal but like it so far, very versatile.
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Hey Frank I bought an Iwata neo with a .35 while I was waiting for delivery of the Paasche Talon TG3 it's the set with three different needle/tip sizes:
Includes:
-6ft braided hose,
-wrench,
-nozzle wrench,
-hanger,
-Needles, Tips, and Head Caps in all three sizes! (.25mm, .38mm and .66mm)
-Plus! The new Fan Aircap (TAF-3.)
Not sure what to make of the fan cap, I put it on the .66 setup and it seemed very uneven with the 1 test I did so the jury is still out on that one but I can tell ya that the .66 will suck the paint out of the cup in the blink of an eye! And I would highly recommend to anyone just getting started to look at the neo, it's not made by but for Iwata and for the money $55) it's a great little brush, the Talon is one honking piece of metal but like it so far, very versatile.
I can tell you about the fan cap. Basically it converts the round spray fan to an oval. Right now if you spray a piece of paper it will be one stream. With the one that looks to be cut out it will be narrow and tall. I see on there site where they give the actual metric numbers. Looked at badgers and they still don't. Using the fan one you could better cover larger areas. And if you think a .66 eats up the paint my .8 is faster.
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This info will be used while I work with some blades that will become trolling spoons for Lake Superior soon. I ordered spoon blanks in gold-plate and silver plate. Somehow the order got doubled and I wasn't charged for it so I called the company and asked how to handle it. They said it would cost more to fiddle around with everything regardless of which direction we took so I should just keep them as their treat. I wasn't even aware of the doubling until two nights ago when I went to the garage to do some prep work and opened the package. That was quite a treat on their part. My original order was for 50 blades so now I have enough to peg in the tackle closet for several years to come.
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If your airbrushing spoons; can I ask what your using for a top coat?
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Gary.....I have a clear coat in a spray can that will be compatible with the water-based colors and that will be applied when everything is dry.
I'll also note here that I only do one side [convex] of each blade and then I only do about 1/2 of that surface in color. The exception is Wonderbread where I apply a full white undercoat on the convex side and while its wet I sprinkle regular glow powder on it, then tap the excess powder off and hang to dry. When that coat is dry I dot the fluorescent blue, yellow and red dots on, then clear coat when they are dry.
I'm hoping to get transparent green, transparent blue, and transparent purple applied to the silver blades along with the white for Wonderbread on three or four of the blades. The Gold blades will get all orange colors and patterns. Other than the Wonderbread the silver patterns will see 1/2 of the face side coated in color running from hole to hole. Some of the gold will see the orange running hole to hole while others will see a 4 or 5 spot pattern with black dot centers.
If things go as planned, I'll post up some pics later.
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Never thought about sprinkling glow powder on the blades. Thinking about little ice fishing blades. You might have something new here. I use the top coat UV liquid to coat my spinner blades I make up for walleye harnesses.
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For dark, heavy days and the low light periods of earl morning and late evening I always liked to throw a silver blade, silver left on the back side with 1/2 blue and the other half deep purple on the face side. Then I discovered Wonderbread glow. The WB sees a lot of water time now and not so much the blue/purple but that blue/purple still travels with me. There are times when it works better than any color combo.
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Gotta love some places. Having sent the airbrush to a "qualified party for service to make it work again, I thought I'd hook it up and do some practice patterns on cardboard using plain, flitered water. Same issue as before....bubbling the water like crazy and no spray. I wonder if the party that supposedly cleaned this thing even ran a water test through it or just made the assumption it was clean. Let's just say the I am not a happy camper.
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Ctom Check to ensure that your tip and aircap are making a good seal, here's a tip take a q tip and apply vasoline on the threads of both and test again bubbles in the cup is caused by an air leak causing air to back up into the cup.
Also check to see if your oring on the air cap is missing or damaged.
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Sounds like it is plugged up with paint. One of the things they recommend in cleaning an airbrush is to cover the tip with your figure. This will cause a "backflow" which makes the paint cup bubble. If your tip or needle is bent this can also shut off the flow, but something is blocked if its bubbling.
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Well, for me, I have the Iwata Hi-Line HP-CH Airbrush and I use only Createx colors. Mostly I do a 50:50 ratio but there are times I will do a 1:3 ratio if I needed a more thinner spray. I also like to add Pledge Floor Wax to my water/paint mixture in the airbrush. It gives it a better shine plus hardens the paint better
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Just for clarification future is not wax based but acrylic based just didn't want any one waxing their paint :o but good tip none the less.
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I shot all the blades with a different gun and lacquer. I wanted to be done with these and thought the air brush would get the job done. Since it was nothing but trouble I cleaned it up good and put it back in the box. I'll fart around with that thing when I don't have anything to do....likely this winter while I wait for the get-together come along.
I'll get a pick later and put it up. They turned out real nice. I didn't do the gold/orange with black spots because I have to cut a stencil to spray the dots and I've had enough fun today. The others I can show you.
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Here they are. I'll let the finish harden a day or so then add the split rings and hooks, then bag them.
(http://i574.photobucket.com/albums/ss184/crappietomtackle/ed5c066c-c467-42c9-8ec7-9efdfa216f94_zps3e25fd93.jpg) (http://s574.photobucket.com/user/crappietomtackle/media/ed5c066c-c467-42c9-8ec7-9efdfa216f94_zps3e25fd93.jpg.html)
Note to self: add the link stupid.
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Here's the last blade I planned to do. Over the years this one color has proven to be the #2 color to use after gold/orange.
(http://i574.photobucket.com/albums/ss184/crappietomtackle/a6fc72ed-895e-4488-b7f1-1ced6ca40e57_zps11baad67.jpg) (http://s574.photobucket.com/user/crappietomtackle/media/a6fc72ed-895e-4488-b7f1-1ced6ca40e57_zps11baad67.jpg.html)
This one is call "Wonder Bread" because of the spots on the white. The white base was sprayed on and allowed to set-up for a couple days. Then a clear coat was applied and immediately a fine dusting of standard glow pigment was laid over the wet clear. When the clear was dry to touch the blades were brushed free of loose pigment, then the dots of blue, pink and chartreuse were applied. When the dots were dry to touch the whole blade received another shot of clear coat. The dots are the transparent vinyl jig paint sold here at Do-It and have some glow pigment in them based on color....blue in blue, red glow in the pink and yellow glow in the chartreuse. These baits are something after sitting in a lit room and then have the lights go out.
This color is a trout color pretty much exclusively. When the trout are deep and won't worry the gold/orange, we'll lay one of these in the sun for as long as it takes to pop one of the baits out of the line clip on a ball and get it to the top for a switch. This color will go on and we'll run right back over marked fish that wouldn't chase before and about 60% of the time they'll hammer this one. With the glow baits we like to run the lure about five feet over the fish on a little longer leash. Normally the baits are run about 20 feet behind the bombs but these we'll let out to about 40. If the fish show no interest after a couple passes we'll make one final pass after dropping the cannonball down about twenty feet lower than the fish and when the locator shows the cannonball right under the fish, we pop the line out of the clip and let the slack tow the lure to the top slowly and with a real loose wobble. There are times when all of out lake trout fall to this tactic.
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looks great tom
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Trying to get my airbrush working again with a few 1.5s. (http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/y5ubedan.jpg)
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Looks like it's working just fine, Tom.
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Very nice
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Thanks guys. It has been about a year or so since I done any painting. I just want to get a few ready for next season.
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