Question about catching sauger or walleye in muddy water

[brandx112679]

  This question is how is the best way to catch walleye in muddy river situation?. Espsecially in cold water. Sorry as you can see I can't spell.
 I would like to here what you have to say, as this is really hard for me.

[jmatheny9]

I too would like to know. Certainly from the bank. All I do is throw a grub and pray they're there. it seems ineffective. Hope this thread grows some feet.


              @bullfroglures

[ctom]

Cold water, river? Do nothing type of fishing. If I am fishing dirty water when its cold you can bet that some sort of purple, blue or another dark color will be on a jig fished vertically a foot or so off the bottom as the boat either drifts or is helped along with an electric. By "do nothing" I mean find your depth, stay vertical, and lift/drop only about 6 or 8 inches every couple minutes, letting the jig back down on a tight line.

Many will cast ring worm or paddletail baits on lighter heads onto shallow water sand flats adjacent to deeper water with more current. They let the jig/bait slide along just off the bottom by keeping the rod tip high and regulating the boat's drift or up-stream movement speed very slooooow. This technique the locals term as "dragging".

Current seams in deeper water where current hits slack is another great area to hunt for fish and then follow the seam with an electric jigging a noise bait like a paddletail. Noise + the thump made when the paddletail is jigged.

When all else fails, a jighead/minnow combination jigged along the seams and thru stretches of deep water will work well. 

[brandx112679]

 Ctom, I have fished the Ohio river for most of my 62 years. I have tried most anything I have ever read or heard, but to successfully catch sauger or walleye in cold muddy water, I have not come up with anything that works well. I appreciate your post, and all these things will work, but I know there has to be a more successful way.
 The Ohio stays muddy most all winter anymore, it seems to get worse every year. When the water does clear, you better get out and catch what you can, because it will be up and muddy again very soon.
 I have added rattles to jigs, used uv soft plastics, used flouresent  colors, minnows and jigs deadsticking and jigging slowly off the bottom, probably the most effective for me yet. Sonar type baits, jigging spoons, and crankbaits.
 I would like to here something from Tommy Skarlis , also to get his opinion. I know the pros do catch them consistently in cold muddy water or they would not be pros for very long.
 But anyone that fishes for these fish, I would love to here your technique .

[ctom]

Sauger and walleye are two entirely different creatures even if they live with each other and share some genetic background. Sauger like darker water and are not at all shy about being in current while walleyes will look for less current and seem to enjoys shallower shelves of calmer water and the shallow, calmer side current breaks. That said, I have found that fishing either saugers OR walleye yields the best results and that by targeting sauger I am likely to find walleyes while the opposite may not happen while I target walleyes.

The largest jig I drop in water at our dams is 3/4 ounce flathead and if the big clunker starts to wash too fast to keep it vertical I go down in line size. Its not all un-common to fish these heavy jigs on 4 pound line. The flat head jig is a super jig for cutting current. When fishing dam faces and main channel deep water a jig that can be kept vertical in deeper fast water will get sauger if the vertical aspect is maintained. If you start dragging the jig or lose the vertical element in deeper water problems with snagging garbage on the bottom begin and the bite drops off. Balance in your rigging for specific conditions is certainly something that will benefit you. Balance is when that jig stays vertical no matter what the conditions. Everything mentioned in this paragraph is aimed at sauger.

Some other little observances about walleye and sauger:
* Walleye are more likely to be found where the sauger prefer to be than sauger being found where walleyes prefer to be.
* walleyes are way more tolerant of daylight than sauger are
Knowing these two little things can help understand where the two fish prefer to be. Next comes the jig and how you are going to deliver a bait. Personally I prefer to use the lightest jig and lines possible to get the plastic or hair to the fish.

[brandx112679]

 Thanks, for the reply Ctom, When we fish below the dam here on the Ohio River, It is not unusual to have half your limit in walleye, and half sauger. There is a 15 inch limit on walleye here. And the sauger and walleye do cross breed and produce what is called saugeye. But the only fishing for walleye that I have ever done was fishing actually for sauger below Cannelton and the Smithland dam on the Ohio.
 Ctom, then actually you are saying that the walleye are more likely to hang out with sauger , than sauger hanging with the walleyes.
 I  Did not know this. Funny thing we have noticed about the sauger fishing here, is the bright sunny days the fish bite the best . A cloudy day the fish usually don't bite as well. It seems it would be the other way around. It is not unusual to catch these fish in 50 foot of water.

[ctom]

Ctom, then actually you are saying that the walleye are more likely to hang out with sauger , than sauger hanging with the walleyes.

That's my observations on the Mighty Miss.

[TommySkarlis]

Muddy water can be tough - especially with Saugers and will be even tougher if the water is falling.  We have a tournament on the Illinois River and when the water gets full of debris, on the islands and chocolate milk - 200 boats (400 contestants) will weigh 5 fish TOTAL. (that's 0.0125 fish per contestant!) proof that the fish just STOP biting.  Short of catastrophic muddy-water-fishing conditions, I will mirror a lot of what ctom is saying by suggesting you try 3/4 or one ounce jigs tipped with large, strange artificial shapes, like lizards, K chub grubs, bass shapes, twin tails, etc. scented with something, I especially like Gulp! Alive juice or PowerBait attractant.  Ultra sharp high quality main hooks and stinger hooks. I use hi-viz super lines like 10/2 Spiderwire Stealth or 8/3 Fireline so that I don't miss a bite.

Finding the cleanest water - like an outlet from a power plant, waste water treatment, etc or a feed creek or river might help.  Also - fish shallow on a sharp break that drops into deep water fast.  Hope this helps.

[efishnc]

I agree with Tommy as bigger baits (up to 7") have been my main producers for better than ten years... and I will typically out-fish guys using the "traditional" bait selections.  I also say look for cleaner water (or slightly warmer water), but if you can't find either, then throw a bait that has lots of presence... to me displacement and vibration rank above color.  I look for sharp drops to work if it is daytime and I work the shallows after sundown.  I'm primarily a "long liner" (which is casting) instead of vertical jigging, but when I relinquish to the latter method based on conditions, I like to POUND the bottom - use a heavier jig than necessary to pound the jig a half dozen times and then hold it up (no more than a foot above the bottom) for a minute or so - I found this gets me far more action than dead-sticking.

Completely aside from jigging, you could try hand-lining or three way trolling on the main channel or deeper sloughs with a shallow diving crank.  This can be a great technique for catching walleye when you don't want to sit still or just want to break away from the flotilla.  A lot of guys prefer the original Rapala style minnow type baits for this presentation because of the subtle action, but don't get locked into this mindset; these same fish will hit blade baits at this time of year, so subtle action may or may not be the way to go here - just go slow so the fish can easily catch the bait.

Nothing is more important than confidence in what you are doing to catch fish; I could fish as Ctom does, and he could fish with my methods, but until we have that top confidence in the other's method, we won't fish as good in it as they do.  (It's almost like a home field advantage.)  So, keep asking, keep learning, keep trying and build that confidence level (and knowledge base) and you'll get more fish.