Author Topic: Homemade Laminate Plates  (Read 14454 times)

Offline grayth

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Homemade Laminate Plates
« on: 01/22/14 07:15 UTC »
Hey everyone - I'm a beginner here to plastics and I recently started with a few molds but have been reading on the forums like a madmen to learn. Any rate I have read many times that many of you have your own methods or ways to make your own homemade laminate plates. I haven't seen any details or pics of the ideas but would love to. Eventually I'll get the actual laminate plates - but starting off with homemade solution is a great way to get off learning..
thanks

Offline jl3140

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #1 on: 01/22/14 07:29 UTC »
Welcome to the forum grayth! What I do for laminates is less of a plate, but it works well most times. I just cut the wall off a soda can and then trim it to fit inside the mold so that I can get 2 sides of the bait and then I close the mold up and shoot the mold with the aluminum in place. This will give you one side of the bait so then you just need to cut the sprue off and re-position the bait back into the mold cavity and close the mold without the soda can piece in it this time and inject the second color for your laminate. I don't currently have any pictures of this process though. Hopefully I've explained it well enough.

Josh

Offline ctom

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #2 on: 01/22/14 08:02 UTC »
If you want a little more rigidity in a thin plate, go to Hobby Lobby and pick up a 4"X7" piece of "punch metal". This is a thin tin sheet, easily cut with household scissors. $4.00 or thereabout.
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Offline grayth

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #3 on: 01/22/14 08:34 UTC »
Ok great sounds easy enough..I suppose with just putting some thin/thick sheet metal like this is a great easy solution - but it will not also slice in half the injection sprue portion if you will? So does this mean just slow down the injection even more?

If that's the case, what's the real advantage then of going with the actual laminate plates then if the same effect can be done with simple sheet metal?

Offline jl3140

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #4 on: 01/22/14 08:56 UTC »
Well if you go with an actual lam plate, you won't end up with half the bait being re-melted because you will only get the half of the bait you want. That being said, I haven't bought a single lam plate in the year and a half I've been injecting baits. I just end up doing a little more remelting

Offline andrewlamberson

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #5 on: 01/22/14 09:09 UTC »
Here's some info from a previous post on using aluminum foil to make a "poor man's laminate plate". The advantage of buying a real laminate plate (that is designed for the mold) is that you only get 1/2 of the bait when you inject and then you just add the other side from the original mold and inject and you get your finished bait...vs. two halves when you use the foil.

By the way...some baits make a pretty good leech when shot as half baits. For example the Glider and the shorter carrot baits. Plus you get 2x the output from the mold!

http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/36-gauge-aluminum-roll-864678/

Cut a piece slightly bigger than your mold. Insert it into the mold and press shut. You may need to reopen and cut a small hole at the alignment pins (most of the time you do not). Cut the sprue hole out with a pair of scissors. I then take a razor blade and trim all the sides so it fits exactly..with one exception....The open end of the mold (across from the hinge) I leave about 1" of foil hanging out so I can mark it with the name/size of the  bait the plate matches up with.

This will give you a "custom" laminate plate...so to speak. When you inject you will get both halves of the bait in the first color. I typically shoot a bunch in one color....then reload the mold with the 1/2 of color 1 and then shoot color 2.

Works VERY well with stick baits!!!! And fast!!!!!

The aluminum is 36 gauge is thicker than aluminium foil...but thinner than anything you can find at the hardware store. It's thin enough that it does not affect the clamping of the mold but will last darn near forever. This method works well for any bait that does not have a "top" or "bottom" ..otherwise you either have to remelt half the bait...or use on of the laminate plates (which is a better idea than remelting!).

I still like the laminate plates better when available...but this works well
" You can't buy happiness...But you can buy fishing gear...and that's kind of the same thing"

Offline ctom

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #6 on: 01/22/14 09:26 UTC »
Not all molds have the accessory lamination plate available. This is when you make your own. The company made lamination plate shoots just one side of the mold so you have little waste to re-melt or toss. The hand made plates simply split the mold in half, but pouring both simultaneously. You do end up with a split sprue, but that is easily trimmed off with the baits still in the mold and the second half of the mold considered discard comes off super easy too.

I have the super fry mold along with the factory made lam plate. The plate shoots the TOP cavity of the bait, where I like using the plate to do the bottom. I like the top and the tail the same color. I just measured the guide pin location on the opposite corner of the factory plate, did a drill job and use the same plate on the bottom cavities now, but it is still able to shoot the tops.

Personally I feel that hand pouring is the ticket. You can pour partial fills in any cavity quickly and easily. Very important here is that the hand poured cavity fill DOES NOT come out of the cavity ever until the bait is finished so getting plastic shooting UNDER a belly that got pulled out during the plate removal just doesn't happen. The natural surface tension holding the hand poured pieces in place is very, very tight. Additionally, and I just commented on this in another post, is that when shooting a bait to appear natural you do not have straight lines running from front to back on the bait. Nature doesn't have a lot of straight anything on anything alive. The hand poured components tend to melt into neighboring colors while plate make a stark separation between color.

Plates, whether factory made or hand made, offer a mold a lot of flexibility, but they come at a cost. Hand pouring is cheap in comparison and the flexibility in bait creation afforded with a plate is perhaps amplified by ten when you hand pour. Plates have limits. Hand pouring is basically limitless.

Here is a picture showing the super fry mold, opened and the lamination plate that I altered to fit the side of the mold showing, the belly/tail section. The black arrows point to the holes which I have drilled to get the flexibility out of the plate that I wanted. The plate is actually designed and made to fit the other half of the mold.



Also shown here is a hand cut plate made of the punch metal I mentioned. I know Andy has used a similar product from the same source. Note the name on the plate as small fry. Also note the two alignment holes. The small fry mold has one alignment pin and one of the holes is for that mold. The nano fry has the same one pin  but I can flip this plate over using the other hole and it fits my nano mold to a tee.

I'll add a little more here about the differences between plate use and hand pouring that has to do with plastic color. Many times different colors of plastic are desired in a single bait and the advent of these plates is great to achieve the results wanted. IF you hand pour and the colors just don't seem to spate enough and you do not want to strengthen the color by adding more to the plastic, the plate comes into play. The stark flat plane the plate creates acts as a mirror for the color that goes on top of the flat side even if the color is fairly transparent. Light enters that top plastic but as it hits the flat surface inside the bait it bounces back and enhances the color it just went thru. IF you add hi lite to the top color, light reflection is more intense than if you have a simple color. Glitteris not the key because glitter is multi-faceted and throws light around in an indiscriminate fashion. The flat plane is your friend in this instance.   
« Last Edit: 01/22/14 09:56 UTC by ctom »
There are good ships
and wood ships
ships that sail the sea
but the best ships are friendships
and may they
always be ......An Irish Toast

Offline andrewlamberson

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #7 on: 01/22/14 09:41 UTC »
2x what Tom said on hand pouring. After seeing what he and others have been doing with hand pours I bought some hand (open) pour molds to practice with and now hand pour most of my multiple color baits. The orange part of these baits are on one side of the bait...now if I could just decide if it's the top...or the bottom!

" You can't buy happiness...But you can buy fishing gear...and that's kind of the same thing"

Offline ctom

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #8 on: 01/22/14 10:00 UTC »
Open molds are great for learning but if you have injection molds I suggest just sitting down and use old or ugly re-melts to practice the hand pouring in the mold's larger cavity. Use two different colors so you can see how things come together. Can the idea of using an injector to drizzle plastic in the cavities....too many headaches come with injectors. Use a simple metal teaspoon and use a smaller cup...so you don't have to fight a big one.
There are good ships
and wood ships
ships that sail the sea
but the best ships are friendships
and may they
always be ......An Irish Toast

Offline grayth

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #9 on: 01/22/14 10:19 UTC »
This is great guys thanks really helps clarify a bunch of posts I was reading on..Amazing how a pic truly does tell a thousand words..Yes I started off with 4 injection molds. I have the 3.5 Carrot, the 3" CC Glider, K Grub, and a 5" Wutzit. Lots I can do there to start, and easy enough straight forward to learn from too.

Oh and I grabbed 2 pyex cups for now the standard size one and I found a smaller 8oz one too. Should be good for those teaspoon size batches.

Now I only wish the weather would warm up a bit, so I can use my shed (freakin cold) - I'm too chicken to bear the wrath of the wife if I use the basement and stink it up with plastic fumes...lol
« Last Edit: 01/22/14 10:21 UTC by grayth »

Offline ctom

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #10 on: 01/22/14 16:25 UTC »
Gray...hit up some thrift stores and look for pyrex custard cups, 6 or 8 ounce. These have low shoulders for working small batches, are easy to mix in and really save on plastic. They have become my favored plastic vessel. I have about 30 of them right now and maybe 10 have plastic colors used for hand pouring at all times.
There are good ships
and wood ships
ships that sail the sea
but the best ships are friendships
and may they
always be ......An Irish Toast

Offline snake River

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #11 on: 01/27/14 13:43 UTC »
Not all molds have the accessory lamination plate available. This is when you make your own. The company made lamination plate shoots just one side of the mold so you have little waste to re-melt or toss. The hand made plates simply split the mold in half, but pouring both simultaneously. You do end up with a split sprue, but that is easily trimmed off with the baits still in the mold and the second half of the mold considered discard comes off super easy too.

I have the super fry mold along with the factory made lam plate. The plate shoots the TOP cavity of the bait, where I like using the plate to do the bottom. I like the top and the tail the same color. I just measured the guide pin location on the opposite corner of the factory plate, did a drill job and use the same plate on the bottom cavities now, but it is still able to shoot the tops.

Personally I feel that hand pouring is the ticket. You can pour partial fills in any cavity quickly and easily. Very important here is that the hand poured cavity fill DOES NOT come out of the cavity ever until the bait is finished so getting plastic shooting UNDER a belly that got pulled out during the plate removal just doesn't happen. The natural surface tension holding the hand poured pieces in place is very, very tight. Additionally, and I just commented on this in another post, is that when shooting a bait to appear natural you do not have straight lines running from front to back on the bait. Nature doesn't have a lot of straight anything on anything alive. The hand poured components tend to melt into neighboring colors while plate make a stark separation between color.

Plates, whether factory made or hand made, offer a mold a lot of flexibility, but they come at a cost. Hand pouring is cheap in comparison and the flexibility in bait creation afforded with a plate is perhaps amplified by ten when you hand pour. Plates have limits. Hand pouring is basically limitless.

Here is a picture showing the super fry mold, opened and the lamination plate that I altered to fit the side of the mold showing, the belly/tail section. The black arrows point to the holes which I have drilled to get the flexibility out of the plate that I wanted. The plate is actually designed and made to fit the other half of the mold.



Also shown here is a hand cut plate made of the punch metal I mentioned. I know Andy has used a similar product from the same source. Note the name on the plate as small fry. Also note the two alignment holes. The small fry mold has one alignment pin and one of the holes is for that mold. The nano fry has the same one pin  but I can flip this plate over using the other hole and it fits my nano mold to a tee.

I'll add a little more here about the differences between plate use and hand pouring that has to do with plastic color. Many times different colors of plastic are desired in a single bait and the advent of these plates is great to achieve the results wanted. IF you hand pour and the colors just don't seem to spate enough and you do not want to strengthen the color by adding more to the plastic, the plate comes into play. The stark flat plane the plate creates acts as a mirror for the color that goes on top of the flat side even if the color is fairly transparent. Light enters that top plastic but as it hits the flat surface inside the bait it bounces back and enhances the color it just went thru. IF you add hi lite to the top color, light reflection is more intense than if you have a simple color. Glitteris not the key because glitter is multi-faceted and throws light around in an indiscriminate fashion. The flat plane is your friend in this instance.
I use a piece of galvanized sheeting which you can go to any hardware store and buy  basically we done  the same thing  as Ctom  we been using this process or a last seven years.

Offline ctom

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #12 on: 01/27/14 14:42 UTC »
I'll just note here that the home-made plates are not what everyone is looking for and the best way to get a handle on using a plate is to get the plate made specifically as a partner plate for your mold from the company. Home-made plates have some advantages the companion plates doesn't off but with some tinkering even the companion plates can have an expanded use, as shown in the pics above with the super fry. The companion plates save a lot on plastic vs the home-made. Each has its attributes, both have things that may not be desired.
There are good ships
and wood ships
ships that sail the sea
but the best ships are friendships
and may they
always be ......An Irish Toast

Offline SBuck88

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Re: Homemade Laminate Plates
« Reply #13 on: 04/17/14 07:02 UTC »
Here's some info from a previous post on using aluminum foil to make a "poor man's laminate plate". The advantage of buying a real laminate plate (that is designed for the mold) is that you only get 1/2 of the bait when you inject and then you just add the other side from the original mold and inject and you get your finished bait...vs. two halves when you use the foil.

By the way...some baits make a pretty good leech when shot as half baits. For example the Glider and the shorter carrot baits. Plus you get 2x the output from the mold!

http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/36-gauge-aluminum-roll-864678/

Cut a piece slightly bigger than your mold. Insert it into the mold and press shut. You may need to reopen and cut a small hole at the alignment pins (most of the time you do not). Cut the sprue hole out with a pair of scissors. I then take a razor blade and trim all the sides so it fits exactly..with one exception....The open end of the mold (across from the hinge) I leave about 1" of foil hanging out so I can mark it with the name/size of the  bait the plate matches up with.

This will give you a "custom" laminate plate...so to speak. When you inject you will get both halves of the bait in the first color. I typically shoot a bunch in one color....then reload the mold with the 1/2 of color 1 and then shoot color 2.

Works VERY well with stick baits!!!! And fast!!!!!

The aluminum is 36 gauge is thicker than aluminium foil...but thinner than anything you can find at the hardware store. It's thin enough that it does not affect the clamping of the mold but will last darn near forever. This method works well for any bait that does not have a "top" or "bottom" ..otherwise you either have to remelt half the bait...or use on of the laminate plates (which is a better idea than remelting!).

I still like the laminate plates better when available...but this works well
I found this post and went to Hobby Lobby to buy that aluminum foil and was able to make my own lami plate, so thanks for the tips andrewlamberson!
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